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5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

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JacobErdey
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5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by JacobErdey » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:41 am

Before I make any major miscues, just want to clarify the appropriate steps. The best way I can try to summarize my question would be mentally visually :lol: So, if we were looking at the hull as a core sample, in layers, from the innermost surface of the boat to the last layer of paint on the bottom would be as follows:
1. 3 coats bilge paint
2. 2 coats bilge primer
3. 2-3 coats CPES on inside of inner planks (to soak into the wood, but not build layers on top)
4. Inner planking
5. 2-3 coats CPES
6. Bed of 5200
7. 2-3 coats of CPES on inside surface of bottom planks
8. Bottom planks
9. 2-3 coats CPES
10. 3-4 coats Interlux 2000e
11. 3-4 coats bottom paint
12. Trailer lol

My main purpose of this question is in regard to the CPES layers on the outside of the inner planks and inside of the bottom planks...that CPES does belong there right? Just wasn't sure if the CPES would interfere with the adherence of the 5200 at all, as if it needed to be able to grab the bare wood or anything like that. Thanks in advance!
Current Project: 1950 Chris Craft Sportsman 18'

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mbigpops
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by mbigpops » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:02 am

5200 adheres just fine to CPES covered wood.

Don't forget that the "Bed of 5200" actually gets applied to both the inner planking exterior and outer planking interior before they get sandwiched together.

Mark
1953 CC Rocket Runabout "Rocket Man"

Denis D
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by Denis D » Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:43 pm

It is my understanding that you do not want a heavy layer of bilge paint so that moisture can still migrate out of the wood. I have been putting just one coat of oil based bilge paint with no primer, as the CPES acts as a primer.

Not sure if that is correct, I would like to hear opinions.

Denis D
Denis

1948 17' deluxe runabout

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robertpaul
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by robertpaul » Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:15 pm

I use this product. It is nice to apply and penetrates very well. Does not need a primer coat. I have on occasion had to sand a bit that I had primed and found the paint had penetrated much deeper than I thought it would. Sandusky says no primer necessary and that it has resistance to oil, gas and deters rot. Original colours too. I agree emphatically that too much paint is to be avoided.
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1937 35' Double Stateroom Enclosed Cruiser

Denis D
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by Denis D » Thu Mar 15, 2018 5:20 pm

I also bought a gallon of the Sandusky 9605 but after painting the stringers, I found it had too much of a purple hue so it did not match the original CC bilge color at all. I took a piece of my boat's interior wood with original bilge paint that had never been exposed to light and had my local Sherwin Williams store computer match it in alkyd enamel which is what the Sandusky paint is. The color match is excellent as is the coverage.

Denis D
Denis

1948 17' deluxe runabout

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robertpaul
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by robertpaul » Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:04 pm

Even paint protected from sunlight will oxidize a bit as it ages.... 70 years at that. I went with it because I am replacing the entire bottom of our cruiser and matching colours was not that critical to me. The Sandusky paint does have rot inhibitors in it, but the best rot inhibitor will always be a dry and very well ventilated bilge. The initial brightness of red paints takes time to mellow out. When I first applied it it did seem crazy bright.
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Don Danenberg
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by Don Danenberg » Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:46 pm

Wow!
This is becoming beyond my ability to respond?
JacobErdey;
1) Nope, just 1-coat of bilge paint, unless you expect your engines to leak a lot of oil (see third post, by Denis D).
2) "Bilge Primer?" See # 3, below.
3) You seem to get that CPES is 'applications, NOT Coats', IT Soaks IN to do its work.
4) Inner Planking
5) Again, 2-3 'Applications', NOT "Coats"; Areas that are 'shiny' do NOT need more applications. CPES glues together the wood fibers.
6) 'Bed of 5200' MUST be ample to fill any voids.
7) Again, "applications" to non-glossy areas.
8) Bottom planks (sorry, I hit some button that made a smily-face, should have been 8).
9) Again, "applications" to non-glossy areas (NOT surface coats).
10) 10-mill of coats of Interlux 2000E, this may take 6-COATS to accomplish this, read the box instructions for sq/ft area.
11) At least 2- COATS Bottom paint.
12) Trailer that supports the bottom shape.

CPES is an "APPLICATION" of a penetrating sealant that glues together the wood fibers that enhances the adherence of following coatings, just by making the wood surface stronger.

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mfine
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by mfine » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:00 am

Don, the board software sees an 8 and a ) as shorthand for a smile with sunglasses. It is quite annoy, but not limited to the Buzz. It was probably programmed by a millennial who has never made a list with more than 7 items.

JacobErdey
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by JacobErdey » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:23 am

Okay great, that clears everything up pretty well. And I'm glad I checked because I would've certainly wasted some hours heading headfirst into working backwards with 4-5 coats in the bilge :shock: Should I be alarmed, or take any measure to remove excess CPES buildup in areas that it has created a "clear coat" where I applied too much, or will those areas still be alright for paint and 5200 to adhere to in their respective locations? I don't have too much of that, but some horizontal areas do have some puddling :(
Current Project: 1950 Chris Craft Sportsman 18'

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Don Danenberg
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Re: 5200 Bottom & CPES clarification

Post by Don Danenberg » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:41 am

Yeah, you should scrape that excess off. Its meant to soak into the surface "abnormal porosity", not puddle on the surface.
A thick surface layer could be a weak link in 5200 attachment. It does promote adhesion of paints and beddings but is not structurally sound as a puddle layer. It is not like a hard, epoxy, laminating glue.

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