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Here We Goooo
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Here We Goooo
Pulling boat tomorrow for leakage,leaks from port chine,shaft log and possibly from keelson area.There is also seepage on starboard chine from side planks.Cannot positively isolate keelson area due to volume of chine leak,attempted to vacuum bilge it filled up from chine leak as fast as water was pulled from area.This should be fun
- Matt Smith
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It looks like somebody has put one wider piece of wood in that one area where two planks were before. And as an extra added bonus have also cut the batten away from where the original seam was between the two planks.
This appears to be an almost perfect example of "sloppy slathering" of 5200 in a poor use of the product. If it is actually 5200 that I see peeking out from some of the joints, as you go to work on this area, you will find components that need to be repaired permanenly stuck together with the Devil Goo. And they will be stuck together so permanently that destruction of adjacent good wood will be necessary unles the 5200 can be cut, or extra wood routed or cut away for removal of bad wood.
Actually, 5200 is an excellent product. But in my opinion has a better application as a panel adhesive or frame to plank glue. To me, WEST SYTEM Epoxy is a better product for heavy, structural repair work. And by that I mean for engine bed log/stringers, chines, keels and etc.
In the case of your previously repaired chine and planking areas, a proper repair with new material and treatment with CPES would have given more than acceptable service without 5200, capable of lasting as long or longer than the original construction. And would be easily removed to work on adjacent areas if the need came up.
Your bilge looks as though a very thorough inspection from both inside and outside is called for. I would be doing a lot of cleaning, pushing, prodding, poking and hard looking at these areas.
All of this will be huge investment in time and money, but that;s what wood boatin is all about. Enjoy the ride!
This appears to be an almost perfect example of "sloppy slathering" of 5200 in a poor use of the product. If it is actually 5200 that I see peeking out from some of the joints, as you go to work on this area, you will find components that need to be repaired permanenly stuck together with the Devil Goo. And they will be stuck together so permanently that destruction of adjacent good wood will be necessary unles the 5200 can be cut, or extra wood routed or cut away for removal of bad wood.
Actually, 5200 is an excellent product. But in my opinion has a better application as a panel adhesive or frame to plank glue. To me, WEST SYTEM Epoxy is a better product for heavy, structural repair work. And by that I mean for engine bed log/stringers, chines, keels and etc.
In the case of your previously repaired chine and planking areas, a proper repair with new material and treatment with CPES would have given more than acceptable service without 5200, capable of lasting as long or longer than the original construction. And would be easily removed to work on adjacent areas if the need came up.
Your bilge looks as though a very thorough inspection from both inside and outside is called for. I would be doing a lot of cleaning, pushing, prodding, poking and hard looking at these areas.
All of this will be huge investment in time and money, but that;s what wood boatin is all about. Enjoy the ride!
Bret
1953 35' Commander "Adonis III"
1970 23' lancer project
1953 35' Commander "Adonis III"
1970 23' lancer project
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I only split with Bret on the use of West System, (guegeon goop)....
the repairs are clearly best done with cpes and new replacement wood, but that is not often possible and almost never affordable. Tough call.
John in Va.
the repairs are clearly best done with cpes and new replacement wood, but that is not often possible and almost never affordable. Tough call.
John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
Time
Its time to get out the chisles and the saws and make it right. I get the feeling from the pics that you'll have to pull a couple of planks before you find out what in there. I'd take a guess there's some decay in the chine.
Not an insurmountable problem. It always looks bad till you get back to good wood.
Not an insurmountable problem. It always looks bad till you get back to good wood.
Jim Evans
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As always Jim Evans is right on....but sometimes the "getting back to good wood"....is the DOCK!!!
This is boat repair 301....no big deal...getter done!
David, I may be down there tomorrow night?
John
This is boat repair 301....no big deal...getter done!
David, I may be down there tomorrow night?
John
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
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Re: Time
evansjw44 wrote:Its time to get out the chisles and the saws and make it right. I get the feeling from the pics that you'll have to pull a couple of planks before you find out what in there. I'd take a guess there's some decay in the chine.
Not an insurmountable problem. It always looks bad till you get back to good wood.
+1
And those bilges need a very thorough cleaning.
You may find that apparent leaking at the keelson is residual water trapped between the inner and outer planking after she's pulled out and allowed to get dry.
I suspect that the chines are the culprit. Likely the sections that are hard to inspect from in the cabin as they are usually under casework, dinette and the head area.
I recently replaced the chines and adjoining bottom and side planks on my 27' Connie and now have a very leak-proof bottom for the first time since owning the little cruiser. They were replaced one side at a time around one year apart. This helped the pocketbook and was a bit more palatable.
Hope that you find that your problems are not extensive and that she will see many more fun cruises in the near future.
I suspect that the chines are the culprit. Likely the sections that are hard to inspect from in the cabin as they are usually under casework, dinette and the head area.
I recently replaced the chines and adjoining bottom and side planks on my 27' Connie and now have a very leak-proof bottom for the first time since owning the little cruiser. They were replaced one side at a time around one year apart. This helped the pocketbook and was a bit more palatable.
Hope that you find that your problems are not extensive and that she will see many more fun cruises in the near future.
Al
Member - Executive Team
Member - Executive Team
I had a similar problem with my 55’ Connie. I removed the board just above the chine board first and then spilled in a replacement board. Then I removed the bottom board next to the chine board and spilled in a new bottom board. Last I removed the chine board and cut and installed a new one. All the new wood was painted on the 6 sides with thinned epoxy (or you could use CPES) before installation. I bedded the new wood with 3M-4200 and I am sure any goop will work. End result no more leaking. If you are not comfortable with the process of soiling in a replacement board then give me your e-mail address and I will send you a MS Word document that shows in pictures and words the spilling process step by step.
Tom Kenny
1961 55' Chris Craft Constellation
Independence - ftkltd.com
1961 55' Chris Craft Constellation
Independence - ftkltd.com
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Out of water now,not as bad as I thought.Mainly missing caulking on transom area,one side plank appears to have a long crack present,will replace it with a new one.Tomorrow I will be at boat and start deconstruction.There are also some other suspect areas that will be sanded and examined.Bottom looks to be sound,will check some fasteners while there.
What your pictures show is not good. The Conies were not made with caulking cotton in the seams. All wood was touching flat on other wood before fastening; goop is okay but no cotton. I recommend that you start taking the boards off around the chine then cleaning everything with a sander or grinder and then rebuild it. But that's me – I don’t like boats that leak.
Tom Kenny
1961 55' Chris Craft Constellation
Independence - ftkltd.com
1961 55' Chris Craft Constellation
Independence - ftkltd.com
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Removed planks on starboard and port side.Chine on port side is in sorry shape,have some wood saved to mill chines out of.The port chine is rotted completely through,appears that a fastener was screwed all the way throgh the chine and was removed.must have had putty or something jammed in the hole but it is long gone now.Starboard chine appears to be pretty well intact.Last three pix are of starboard side.
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Oh well the rot extends all the way to the bow on the port side.Guess the old girl will be grilling hot dogs shortly.Going to remove any thing of value and destroy her.Will try to save some of the planks.Will have some side glass for sale and two new windshields that we made.Frames on windshields are white oak and exact match for the boat.
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Phil and all:Kinda went off deep end Saturday,the plan is to replace port chine that is exposed,have enough good planking to recycle from transom replacement to skin the hull.Will be back at it Saturday.Dr Gadow from the Wood Boat Mental Health Center gave me inspiration to continue the insanity with no change in medication.Ryan I really enjoyed the visit and meeting the family.
lol...no problem Dave! Shes not that bad. I was thinking about you Monday when we took ours out for a 10 hour cruise, just remembering all those times on the hard scratching my head wondering how crazy I was......but in the end it sure is worth it!
Let me know when you want to take a day off during a weekend and come down to Urbanna...take a cruise and drink some liquid bread.....maybe we can lure John over also!
Now go get that chine fixed and those planks back on!
Let me know when you want to take a day off during a weekend and come down to Urbanna...take a cruise and drink some liquid bread.....maybe we can lure John over also!
Now go get that chine fixed and those planks back on!
Respect Dave !63constellation wrote:Phil and all:Kinda went off deep end Saturday,the plan is to replace port chine that is exposed,have enough good planking to recycle from transom replacement to skin the hull.Will be back at it Saturday.Dr Gadow from the Wood Boat Mental Health Center gave me inspiration to continue the insanity with no change in medication.Ryan I really enjoyed the visit and meeting the family.
Don`t feed angry Wolves
All of you who save those big boats have my utmost respect. It surely gives me drive to take care of my little 54 Sportsman. I am just afraid of the sickness spreading. I am prone to adopting difficult projects, but I need more experience first.
Thanks for the great topic an good luck with the work.
Dave
Thanks for the great topic an good luck with the work.
Dave
1954 CC Sportsman 17
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Back problem is hopefully fixxed,nuttin 4 hours of surgery and installation of pedicle screws into L3 and L4 vertebrae.Surgeon also opened up some stenosis, removed bone spurs and large quantity of scar tissue from area.Been almost a month now,feel better than I have in years.Surgeon is confident further improvement will come with time,bed rest and walking daily for about 6-7 months.Before I went under knife,had chine repair,hull planks and bottom plank repairs performed.Also reinforced ribs and replaced and retorqued chine bolts.
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David,!!! welcome back...with a new BACK....I know you have been having it rough....but sounds promising at last!
I have a blown engine....great help from guys here on the site but still not right.
Call me or I will see you in D-ville soon.
John in Va.
I have a blown engine....great help from guys here on the site but still not right.
Call me or I will see you in D-ville soon.
John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
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Welcome back Dave!...I went to Deltaville a few weeks back to check on ya, and thats when I found out you were getting a back overhaul.
We headed to York River Yacht Haven last weekend...that 7 hours out in the Bay was an adventure! After 2 years in Urbanna we moved on.
Looks like you are making some headway on the Connie.
We headed to York River Yacht Haven last weekend...that 7 hours out in the Bay was an adventure! After 2 years in Urbanna we moved on.
Looks like you are making some headway on the Connie.
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