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drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

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jim g
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by jim g » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:13 pm

iamallthumbs wrote:It has been a long winter but I did remove the engine and had it rebuilt along with the transmission. We found that the transmission shaft actually sheared off. Apparently there was enough friction on the two pieces to enable the shaft to spin until it finally separated.
Now that is it time to attach the transmission to the engine we find that the splines on the tail end of the engine shaft only engage approximately 1/3 of the gear teeth of the transmission. The engine and the transmission look exactly like the photos in this thread. Does this sound correct?
Is the gearbox going on all the way and mating up to the engine?

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:22 pm

Yes the transmission is mating tight to the engine.
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

jim g
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by jim g » Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:46 pm

Since its going all the way on. It should be fine. How can you tell its only engaging 1/3 of the teeth? Can you post a picture of what your seeing?

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Wed Apr 01, 2015 10:03 pm

My mechanic noticed that the grease on the splines indicated only 1/3 of the length was smeared after putting the transmission on the motor. Nothing else appears to be wrong so it is probably much about nothing. Thanks for your help.
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

jim g
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by jim g » Wed Apr 01, 2015 10:18 pm

Only the 3 short gears engage the nose gear.

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:42 pm

Half a year later the reverse gear housing was installed properly and the motor put back in the boat. The next problem was aligning the shaft to the motor. After much swearing, cursing, and head scratching I removed the strut, bolted the couplings together, and positioned the motor as far forward as practical. I replaced the strut on the shaft and find that it hangs about a half inch below the hull or has to be positioned a couple inches forward of the existing strut bolt holes to line up with the motor.

I have conclude that the professional who redid the boat ten years ago installed the shaft log too far forward. Instead of correcting his mistake, he apparently forced the couplings together since the motor could not be aligned correctly. I believe that this misalignment resulted in the damage to the reverse gear. I think that the boring for the shaft log is large enough to align the motor with the strut if I move the shaft log. BUT, the shaft log was bedded in 5200 and I am having a bear removing the shaft log without breaking something.

I will be heating the bronze shaft log to see if I can remove it and position it correctly so that the strut can be reinstalled without a shim. If necessary I will plug and rebore the shaft hole. I realize this description is brief and may not be perfectly clear, but does anyone have any comments on this course of action?
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

joanroy
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by joanroy » Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:53 pm

I don't know if heating the shaft log is the way to go. 5200 is tough stuff, but you can cut it. I think I'd try using a vibrating multi- master with a good sharp blade.

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Wed Nov 18, 2015 9:05 pm

I saw that suggestion on another post and will give it a try. Thanks.
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

jfrprops
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by jfrprops » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:03 pm

That 1/3 rd penetration does not sound right at all??? no need to remind you to be very careful with that stuff....let us know how this turns out....interesting to us .....frustrating to you.....good luck.

John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Thu Apr 28, 2016 10:35 am

Is it safe to assume that all 17' CC Runabouts constructed in 46-47 have the shaft hole in the same location through the keel? As reported previously, I believe that the hole was constructed 3 inches forward of the correct location. This assumption is based upon the strut, and also that the prop shaft is 3 inches longer than the original CC spec. Furthermore, I am comparing this boat (which has a K) to another 17' Runabout with a Chrysler motor. The only way I can figure out how to get the shaft and motor aligned is to bring the motor aft so the front of the engine can be lowered more than I can do now. Moving the engine aft will require the shaft hole to be relocated aft.
In other words, I believe that the strut is in the correct location so that is where I am starting from. Working from aft to fore, the next alignment has to be with the hole. Since there is a hole already, I will remove wood on the aft side of the oval hole through the hull until I can get the shaft to move high enough so that the shaft can be aligned with the strut, shaft log, and engine. Since the size of the hole is not critical as long as it is covered by the shaft log and can be sealed, I might only paint the freshly exposed wood and put the boat back together. If the hole is too big, I will make a wood plug and epoxy it in, then drill a new hole.
Would anyone with a 46-47 17; runabout be able to measure on the outside of the hull, how far forward the fore edge of the shaft hole is from the stern of the boat?
Thoughts, questions???
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

tph
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by tph » Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:36 pm

Mike,
Have two keels here from 1946 17' deluxes. Both measure the same from the transom on bottom side.
24 3/4" back end of hole, 28 5/8" to front end of shaft hole.
Tom

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Fri Apr 29, 2016 8:43 pm

Thanks for checking Tom. Your measurements convince me that the shaft hole was drilled in the wrong location. what a nightmare this boat has turned into. I am amazed that a person who claims to be a "professional boat restorer" made such a mess of this boat.
Anyway, thanks again for your help Tom.
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

jim g
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by jim g » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:25 pm

iamallthumbs wrote: I am amazed that a person who claims to be a "professional boat restorer" made such a mess of this boat.
You would be shocked at the things I have seen come out of so called professional shops in the last 19 years I've been restoring these boats.

I wish I had taken pictures. That would make a hell of a book.

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mbigpops
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by mbigpops » Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:23 am

Mike,

I had the same problem as you after drilling my own keel hole and it had nothing to do with the hole location.

After going crazy for a week or so I looked at the original keel and it was hogged out where the strut mounts to fix the angle. Could have been original.

You are probably going to end up with a shim somewhere. If you don't like a shim on the strut then remove it and the shaft log and then you may have to shim the shaft log inside the boat. That is what I ended up doing.

Mark
1953 CC Rocket Runabout "Rocket Man"

iamallthumbs
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Re: drive shaft pulled out transmission seal-lost all oil

Post by iamallthumbs » Tue Sep 13, 2016 9:23 pm

Last month I was able to convince Steve Bunda in Crandon, Wisconsin to see if he could help me out (he is the guy with the workshop floor that you could eat off of). He just got done repainting his shop floor and was waiting on his next project so he agreed to see what he could do. Long story short, he spent 15 hours straightening out the engine/coupling/shaft log/strut alignment. The keel hole was drilled incorrectly by the "other" rebuilder so Steve had to reset the strut, modify the hole, adjust the shaft log, and install shims under the aft motor mounts to get the alignment right. Apparently this was his 61st such motor alignment so I figure if I kept at it myself I would still be working on it 15 months later. Thanks Steve, good to know that there are professionals out there.
Mike D.

1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-413 BOOMER (user boat)
1947 CC Deluxe Runabout R-17-872 ZOOM-ZOOM (project boat)
1965 25' Folkboat SALTY DOG (lapstrake sailboat)
Barn with room for more boats!

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