Interior Paint Color

Happy Boater · Post by **Happy Boater** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:34 am

While the engine is out of my 1950 18 foot Riviera I thought it to be a great time to repaint the engine compartment... Question. Does anyone have the proper paint color code number? I can not find it in any of the Chris Craft spec books I have... I know it's a shade of red. Any help would be appreciated... Thanks.

Al Benton · Post by **Al Benton** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:03 pm

Doug, Tom King posted Dale Tassell's secret recipe not long ago for CC Red home made bilge paint. He uses a 50/50 mixture of Benjamin Moore #100-20 RED Premium Paint and Floods Penetrol Paint Conditioner. To this he adds about 15-20% varnish (your choice).

There are some "off the shelf" products out there that's been posted somewhere here in Boat Buzz but I can't locate them.

Al

Alan B · Post by **Alan B** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:37 pm

Sandusky Paint Company says they supplied paint to the CC plant in Holland. They sell a number of different paints for Lyman, CC and others, including the red CC bilge paint. www.sanpaco.com

Also, maybe less well know outside of the Algonac area is Kush Paint. They mic their own paints and claim to have supplied to the CC plant in Algonac. They have a number of the CC paints, including the red bilge paint. I've used the Kush paints, they are excellent and very well priced. My last gallon of red bilge paint (called "Tile Red" was $21.95 per gallon (not quart). The red matched what was left of the interior of the post war runabout I was painting. Kush is at 586-293-4545. Their $8/Qt varnish is also very good.

steve bunda · Post by **steve bunda** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 8:27 pm

hi, If you talk with 10 diffrent boat rebuilders,10 different boat owners and 10 different original boat owners , you may get 30 different chris craft red color shades. I belive this is due to a few facts.Chris craft put the paint on for protection and did not worry about consitancy in color shades. IN The manufacture envirement most likly extra paint at the end of the work day went into the same 55 gal barrel.Also Old paint changes its look after age , especially if it had lead in its compound.I am sure when the factory ran out of paint they grabbed any thing form the hardware store down the street.So after many, many, boats that I have worked on ,I settled on Cabots barn red solid color stain,has a nice soft deep red tone that looks a little aged. thanks,steve

Happy Boater · Post by **Happy Boater** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 8:37 pm

From what I am hearing (reading) there are a number of different colors/shades that may be used and could be considered 'original'... I've heard several say a 'stain' was used. One post indicted a mixture of paint and varnish. Would they (Chris-Craft) then or should we now ever consider using an enamal paint? A local paint store in my town has a formula from a local boat rebulder that is an enamal based paint... According to the boat rebuilder, he uses this in all the boats he does... Bottom line, If I used an enamel paint, would it do any damage to the old wood bottom by way of sealing water in the wood, not letting the wood breath and dry out etc...???
So little time and so much to learn!

maritimeclassics · Post by **maritimeclassics** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:40 am

You could always remove a small piece of wood and take the sample into your local Miller or Rodda paint store and have them match the color. I have used enamel based paint and then had them match the color, then adding some flatting agent and have had great results. They most likely used lead based paint back then and so applying enamel would be about the same I would think. I was told by my uncle that they coated everything in the boats (not so much in the early years from what I have seen, under the decks at the covering boards.) even applying varnish up under the forward decks in some painted boats. Some times I have witnessed un-painted surfaces that had mold spores on them which then starts to hold moisture and could speed up the rot. I do have the Rodda color number if you would like it; I think you have the stores up in Washington.

Bill Basler · Post by **Bill Basler** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 10:31 am

Adding to the opinions here, I agree that there is not one clearcut answer on this topic. If you study company records for various eras, you'll see that Chris-Craft seemed to have a favored supplier of the time, that changed every so often. who knows why? As frugal as the company was known to be, and as meticulous with record-keeping as they were, I would assume that they were early pioneers in the supply chain management driven manufacturing methods. I have to believe there was an eye on quality...but I am guessing that their decisions were based as much on cost and service as anything.

Numerous pre war documents point out the use of "Boydell Boycraft" varnishes. The memos are written in such a fashion that it implies that Boydell was not the "normal" varnish, rather a "new" varnish, or a "special" varnish for special applications such as show boats are finicky customers. Go the to archive at www.chris-craft.org/archive, and search for keyword, "Boydell" and you will see numerous examples.

Repcolite was another supplier of bilge paint, but I believe their involvement was post WW II.

Then there's Sandusky Paint. According to their web site, "Over the years Sandusky Paint Co. had been distributing its products to several area boat builders such as Lyman Boat Works, Chris Craft, Mathews Boat Co., Inland Seas, and several other companies.

Finally, you'll also see George Kirby Paint mentioned from time to time.

I don't know for sure whether factory documentation notes "Sandusky Paint" or "Kirby Paint" but my point is that it appears that paints and varnishes were bought from many suppliers over the years.

In my opinion... (not worth much) I am as much in tune with that actual porosity and sheen as I am color. My pre war barrelback appears to have only one coat of bilge paint. It is very matte, and the woodgrain is pretty open. Back to Steve Bunda's comment, about stains. I have used Cabot products an they are among the best out there. Obviously Cabot does not have much of a name in boat restoration circles, but I could definitely see how an opaque Cabot stain could work great. Steve, Oil based stain?

I think my preference would be to have the bilge be pretty open grained. Afterall, it will get multiple coats, yet again, after the freshness of the restoration/new bottom job is history. Over time, the wood grain will be buried deep under multiple coats of paint, so I think I'll try to do as the factory did and keep things "barely" covered.

Happy Boater · Post by **Happy Boater** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:08 pm

I can tell from the comments that there appears to be not real stead-fast agreement on this subject. I've heard a lot of great ideas and will research them all. When the job is done I will post a photo and the paint type etc to show the end results.
Thanks to all of you.

steve bunda · Post by **steve bunda** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:16 pm

Yes Bill , You got it, the less paint,more open grain,this more closely matches the many boats I have seen. I use oil stain as I belive it adheres to the oily bilge better. Of course one must clean and degrease the boat as much as possible.I even go further on some projects sand the surface and follow up with a deglosser to prep the surface.thanks,steve

DeanS29 · Post by **DeanS29** » Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:09 pm

What is the best degreaser to use for cleaning the bilge prior to painting. Some of the wood, especially under the engine seems to be pretty oil soaked. I am concerned the paint/stain won't stick. Thanks Dean

steve bunda · Post by **steve bunda** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 8:56 am

Hi,I use Dawn dish washer cleaner to start, then I try some others such as , simple green,basic H,my mentor claims castral super orange is the best ,but watch out it will discolor engine paint.One time we tried a pressure washer,forget it , just makes a mess.The best is a good old rag with a solvent and a lot of elbow grease, maybe someone else has a magic cleaner? steve

JimF · Post by **JimF** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:22 am

Try getting the bilge damp. Then sprinkle a lot of Tide powdered detergent all over. Let sit for a while. Scrub with a brush and rinse.

evansjw44 · Post by **evansjw44** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 2:12 pm

For what its worth I use Lestoil straight as a degreaser. Its got pine oil and something like emulsified kerosine. It really cuts the grease ans oil if you just paint it on and let it sit for a while. It washes right off.

I have also used a car engine bay foaming cleaner. I don't recall the name.